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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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The continued drama we call "parsing": Elaine Corral Kendall |
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| Registered: March 29, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Dr Pavlov: Quote:
... I guarantee that in a year, you will see a massive improvement and 90% of these arguments will become HISTORY. ... Once again, you act as if you are working with Invelos on new improvements. Please, share those informations, or stop playing a game to give you an importance you have not. | | | | Images from movies |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 |  Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | And you were the one that asked me to share...yeah right.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | ********Personal Attack********* | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video | | | | Last edited: by Forum Moderator |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 1,819 |
| | Posted: | | | | Once again this thread (and many others like it) only serve to re-emphasize my opinion that the Credited As should be a local-only feature (or an opt-in feature when accepting a profile as Ken has mentioned may happen).
I can see where Skip is coming from though.
If we kept strictly to the credits eventually the CLT would reflect accurately what is actually in the credits. From there it would be easier to determine the most common name using the CLT.
As it stands the CLT is ever changing which makes maintaining an accurate Credited As database a completely nightmare.
To me it's really not worth the time and effort that goes into it (especially with this kind of debate). I'd rather see it go local and stop these boring threads.
Just IMO.
It would also stop people voting NO to profile changes that restore 'as credited' names. I recently did an update and ONE actor was incorrectly listed. I changed it to the as credited name and people are voting NO based on the CLT.
I personally think it is absolutely wrong to vote NO because someone has failed to utilise the Credited As function - it is not required that the Credited As be used; and voting NO in an attempt to force someone to use it is out of line as far as I am concerned. | | | | Last edited: by Pantheon |
|   | T!M | | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 8,667 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Pantheon: Quote:
Once again this thread (and many others like it) only serve to re-emphasize my opinion that the Credited As should be a local-only feature (or an opt-in feature when accepting a profile as Ken has mentioned may happen). Actually, this thread has nothing to do with "credited as" or with the CLT. Both Elaine/Corral/Kendall and Elaine//Corral Kendall are exactly as credited. Quoting Pantheon: Quote:
If we kept strictly to the credits eventually the CLT would reflect accurately what is actually in the credits. From there it would be easier to determine the most common name using the CLT. And when do you think we'd reach that point? A year from now? Five years? Never? If there's no incentive to enter "as credited" data right now, why would anyone do so? I know I wouldn't, and from the state of the database we know that hardly anybody ever did that even when it was the rule. I couldn't care less about the spelling variations seen on-screen - don't get me wrong: I'll happily track them for you in the "credited as" field if that's what it takes - but I do need the credits to properly link together, and I need that right now. Not possibly in a year's time, or five, or whatever... Quote:
I personally think it is absolutely wrong to vote NO because someone has failed to utilise the Credited As function Yet Ken has gone on record as saying that it IS allowed to do so. And rightly so, of course: failure to use it is an error like any other. If I miss one and someone points that out, I'm very grateful. That's how the database improves. Quote:
it is not required that the Credited As be used Yes it is - the rules flat out say: "Use the "Credited As" field where the person's name differs from the credited name." Period. | | | | Last edited: by T!M |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 6,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
Q
I am not ignoring that fact. I am saying it doesn't matter. For better or worse, the credits are our standard. If they say that François is spelled with a 'c', error or not, we spell it that way. Why would I treat a credit of 'Corral-Kendall' any different? Now, don't get me wrong, if I can find an official source that says the credit is wrong, I am happy to go with that. If not, I have to go with the credits. Where did I say that we should not enter 'Corral-Kendall' as 'Corral-Kendall' in DVDP if that's what the credits say? What I said is that just because it is 'Corral-Kendall' in a single film's credits is not conclusive proof that 'Corral-Kendall' is in fact her actual last name for the purposes of "Common Name'. You seem to have a talent for twisting my meaning. | | | | Hal |
| | Registered: March 10, 2007 | | Posts: 524 |
| | Posted: | | | | Because of the lack of clear evidence one way or the other, I would leave the common name as being parsed E/C/K. For the time being, that matches what is most common in the database and there doesn't seem to be compelling evidence to change that. | | | | Invelos Software, Inc. Representative |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 6,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Gerri Cole: Quote:
Because of the lack of clear evidence one way or the other, I would leave the common name as being parsed E/C/K. For the time being, that matches what is most common in the database and there doesn't seem to be compelling evidence to change that. That seems to be the appropriate decision without further evidence. Thanks, Gerri. | | | | Hal |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 2,394 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Dr. Killpatient: Quote:
Unless they chose to legally change their middle name when the get married, their maiden/birth name does not become their middle name. You simply cannot make such a generalization. Your saying that the maiden name does not become the middle name is no more valid than if I said the maiden name does become the middle name. Where and when I grew up (Mid-western US, late 50s-mid 60s) the custom was for the maiden name to become the middle name. There wasn't any special "legal" procedure they had to go through, it just was accepted that Jane / Marie / Jones became Jane / Jones / Smith when she wed John Smith. I think Gerri's right about using the E / C / K parsing unless/until we have compelling evidence otherwise. | | | Another Ken (not Ken Cole)
Badges? We ain't got no badges. We don't need no badges. I don't have to show you any stinking badges.
DVD Profiler user since June 15, 2001 |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,198 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting hal9g: Quote:
Where did I say that we should not enter 'Corral-Kendall' as 'Corral-Kendall' in DVDP if that's what the credits say? Where did I say you said that? Quote:
What I said is that just because it is 'Corral-Kendall' in a single film's credits is not conclusive proof that 'Corral-Kendall' is in fact her actual last name for the purposes of "Common Name'. And I said that, because the credits are our standard, it was proof enough for me. Quote:
You seem to have a talent for twisting my meaning. Funny, I was just thinking the same thing about you.  | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,198 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Gerri Cole: Quote:
Because of the lack of clear evidence one way or the other, I would leave the common name as being parsed E/C/K. For the time being, that matches what is most common in the database and there doesn't seem to be compelling evidence to change that. It is most common in the db because most users don't question it. While I don't agree, I will bow to your decision. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 6,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
Quoting hal9g:
Quote:
Where did I say that we should not enter 'Corral-Kendall' as 'Corral-Kendall' in DVDP if that's what the credits say?
Where did I say you said that?
You asked the following question: Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
Why would I treat a credit of 'Corral-Kendall' any different? By asking that question, you are more than implying that I said that it should be treated differently. That is just flat wrong. I never said it should be treated differently. After all this time, you know darn well that I am a strong proponent "As Credited". 'Corral-Kendall' would definitely go in the "As credited" field, however, the Common Name must be determined, according to the Rules when a person's name is different than the way they are credited, which they are in this case. When determining a Common Name is required, you can't just say, oh it's 'Corral-Kendall' in the credits, so that's proof enough to enter it as the "Actor Name" field without checking to see if the Common Name would be different per the CLT. You love to cherry pick little bits and pieces of a post and argue them when they are incidental to the main point being made. Thankfully, Gerri injected some common sense into this thread!  | | | | Hal | | | | Last edited: by hal9g |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,198 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting hal9g: Quote:
You asked the following question:
Quoting Unicus69:
Quote:
Why would I treat a credit of 'Corral-Kendall' any different?
By asking that question, you are more than implying that I said that it should be treated differently. That's is just flat wrong. I never said it should be treated differently. That is not what I was implying, but you go ahead and believe what you want. Quote:
After all this time, you know darn well that I am a strong proponent "As Credited". 'Corral-Kendall' would definitely go in the "As credited" field, however, the Common Name must be determined, according to the Rules when a person's name is different than the way they are credited, which they are in this case. When determining a Common Name is required, you can't just say, oh it's 'Corral-Kendall' in the credits, so that's proof enough to enter it as the "Actor Name" field without checking to see if the Common Name would be different per the CLT. And you have the nerve to accuse me of twisting what you said. We are talking about the parsing of the common name, not what the common name is. Never did I say we should enter 'Corral-Kendall' as the common name. What I said was, a credit of 'Corral-Kendall' was proof enough to parse the common name as 'Elaine/ /Corral Kendall' instead of 'Elaine/Corral/Kendall'. Quote:
You love to cherry pick little bits and pieces of a post and argue them when they are incidental to the main point being made. Again, I was thinking the same thing about you since, based on your post, you had no idea what I was talking about. At least, now, I know why you thought I was implying something I wasn't.  | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar | | | | Last edited: by TheMadMartian |
| | Registered: May 19, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,916 |
| | Posted: | | | | Perhaps it's time to agree to disagree. |
| | Registered: March 11, 2009 | | Posts: 211 |
| | Posted: | | | | I think the dear DR is correct in this case.... starting to go down a dangerous road... |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 1,819 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting T!M: Quote:
Yes it is - the rules flat out say: "Use the "Credited As" field where the person's name differs from the credited name." Period. So in effect everyone is breaking the rules doing 'As Credited'. How ridiculous. |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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