|
|
Welcome to the Invelos forums. Please read the forum
rules before posting.
Read access to our public forums is open to everyone. To post messages, a free
registration is required.
If you have an Invelos account, sign in to post.
|
|
|
|
Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
Page:
1... 3 4 5 6 7 ...17 Previous Next
|
We need Clarification On 'quotes', and not just voting will get it done. |
|
|
|
Author |
Message |
Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 3,480 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote: Wrong Unicus. I gave you an answer base on the the screen cap provided. You gave me an answer that I said was reasonable and even expanded on it some, Rifter epanded on it further. I can't provide anymore that what I was shown. I would be willing to guess that your answer was correct and that being able to view the way the credits actually functioned would provide us the answer, and I suggested that James might be helpful in this regard, but he hasn't as yet.
Skip I don't own the title in question either. I have no further information to provide. | | | ...James
"People fake a lot of human interactions, but I feel like I fake them all, and I fake them very well. That’s my burden, I guess." ~ Dexter Morgan |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 21,610 |
| Posted: | | | | OK then I guesson that one we are dead in the water for the moment, James. Now I am intrigued and I may actually have to track down a copy.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!! CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it. Outta here
Billy Video |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 21,610 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting m.cellophane: Quote: Quoting skipnet50:
Quote: I am only saying that in the interest of accuracy and usability "Mister Roberts" has to be acknowledged in some form as well as Mister Roberts.
You've said usability again. I just got caught up on 2 pages of this thread and have not seen you address how recording a title with quotes increases usability. It increases usability because it is factually correct, no matter your individual interpretation they DO appear on the screen, whether you or I like it or not. If it is accuracy and usability we are ultimately after then that becomes just as much a part of the equation as the "legal" name. So the question becomes simplky how do we accomodate BOTH pieces of data, and I will give you Mister Roberts in the key field or The Birds as the case may be. To me argument is narrowly focused on ignoring the AA CREDITED and allowing yourself the ability to determine whether they are valid or not. I am saying they are BOTH valid and we simply need to figure out how to deal with it. Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!! CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it. Outta here
Billy Video |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 13,202 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote: You have a workable solution that is OUTSIDE of the Rules PERIOD Whether or not it is outside of the rules is open for debate. As I have said, I believe the rules are silent on what constitutes the tite. However, even if it were outside the rules, my suggestion would be to change the rules rather than change the program. Quote: and you are far more intersted in saying NO to me, than you are in actually seeing that what I am saying is very reasonable. Oh come on Skip! You know better than that. I focus on the argument and not the person making it. As for it being a 'reasonable', that depends on your point of view. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever. There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom. Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand. The Centauri learned this lesson once. We will teach it to them again. Though it take a thousand years, we will be free. - Citizen G'Kar |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 13,202 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote: OK then I guesson that one we are dead in the water for the moment, James. Now I am intrigued and I may actually have to track down a copy.
Skip For the record, the credits roll from the top down. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever. There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom. Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand. The Centauri learned this lesson once. We will teach it to them again. Though it take a thousand years, we will be free. - Citizen G'Kar |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 3,480 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote: It increases usability because it is factually correct, no matter your individual interpretation they DO appear on the screen, whether you or I like it or not. If it is accuracy and usability we are ultimately after then that becomes just as much a part of the equation as the "legal" name. You are equating accurate (which I dispute) with usability. They're two different things. There is no increase in usability. At all. In fact, your method disables the ability to search for titles that begin with certain words unless you first guess that a quote might be the first character. It is not accurate to say that the quotes are part of the title due to the fact that (1) quotes are a historical grammatical form for denoting titles and the fact that (2) most films from this time period use quotes around their titles. You haven't done anything to disprove either of these facts. There is no accuracy with your method. There is no usability with your method. Quote:
So the question becomes simplky how do we accomodate BOTH pieces of data, and I will give you Mister Roberts in the key field or The Birds as the case may be. To me argument is narrowly focused on ignoring the AA CREDITED and allowing yourself the ability to determine whether they are valid or not. I am saying they are BOTH valid and we simply need to figure out how to deal with it. Including quotes is not "as credited". Including quotes without proof that they're part of the title is a misunderstanding of English grammar and is itself an error. Only rarely will you find a title that can be proven to include quotes. To include quotes for every title that includes them on-screen out of fear that a user who was not part of the film production might leave out a justified quote mark...is beyond unreasonable and on its way to becoming hysterically detrimental. It would certainly be one way to destroy a good program. | | | ...James
"People fake a lot of human interactions, but I feel like I fake them all, and I fake them very well. That’s my burden, I guess." ~ Dexter Morgan |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 2,372 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting lyonsden5: Quote: Quoting northbloke:
Quote: [...] and I'd really like to know the people's reasons for voting no on their removal.
Well you could add it to your collection and look, but if adding by title you won't find it under Mister Rogers. You will have to look for it under "Mister Rogers" (or have the substring filter on). My typo from page one looks more like some type of forward-seeing Freudian slip. This whole thread is more like something out of Mr. Rogers Neighborhood than any reality I know of. meow-meow-meow-meow gotta go... I hear the Trolley comin |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 3,480 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting lyonsden5: Quote: gotta go... I hear the Trolley comin Now, Trolley, do you think the quotes are part of the title or not part of the title?ding...ding...ding That's right, Trolley. It's really so easy; isn't it?ding... Goodbye, Trolley...ding...ding...ding...ding...ding...ding... | | | ...James
"People fake a lot of human interactions, but I feel like I fake them all, and I fake them very well. That’s my burden, I guess." ~ Dexter Morgan |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 2,372 |
| Posted: | | | | That trolley's almost as smart as a llama I know |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 13,202 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote: It increases usability because it is factually correct, no matter your individual interpretation they DO appear on the screen, whether you or I like it or not. If it is accuracy and usability we are ultimately after then that becomes just as much a part of the equation as the "legal" name. So the question becomes simplky how do we accomodate BOTH pieces of data, and I will give you Mister Roberts in the key field or The Birds as the case may be. To me argument is narrowly focused on ignoring the AA CREDITED and allowing yourself the ability to determine whether they are valid or not. I am saying they are BOTH valid and we simply need to figure out how to deal with it.
Skip Being factually correct, which I dispute, doesn't increase usability. It may increase accuracy but it definately decreases usability. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever. There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom. Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand. The Centauri learned this lesson once. We will teach it to them again. Though it take a thousand years, we will be free. - Citizen G'Kar |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 2,694 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote: Quoting skipnet50:
Quote: OK then I guesson that one we are dead in the water for the moment, James. Now I am intrigued and I may actually have to track down a copy.
Skip
For the record, the credits roll from the top down. Then they read "Kiss Me Deadly" just as I postulated. So that argument that they should be the other way around is bogus. | | | John
"Extremism in the defense of Liberty is no vice!" Senator Barry Goldwater, 1964 Make America Great Again! |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 2,694 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote: Quoting skipnet50:
Quote: It increases usability because it is factually correct, no matter your individual interpretation they DO appear on the screen, whether you or I like it or not. If it is accuracy and usability we are ultimately after then that becomes just as much a part of the equation as the "legal" name. So the question becomes simplky how do we accomodate BOTH pieces of data, and I will give you Mister Roberts in the key field or The Birds as the case may be. To me argument is narrowly focused on ignoring the AA CREDITED and allowing yourself the ability to determine whether they are valid or not. I am saying they are BOTH valid and we simply need to figure out how to deal with it.
Skip
Being factually correct, which I dispute, doesn't increase usability. It may increase accuracy but it definately decreases usability. What appears on the screen, Unicus? Hmm? Are there quotes around the title or not? If there are, and you say they shouldn't be included under the "as credited" rule, then you are denying the reality of what your eyes see. That is irrational behavior. I don't give a damn whether they are there are not personally, but if the film makers put them there, it is stupendously ignorant and irrational not to include them as they appear. I get that you don't like them, and I get that others don't like them, but none of you have made a convincing argument as to why they should be left out if that is what appears on screen. You guys either follow the rules as written (as you so often scream at me) or admit that you're nothing but a bunch of hypocrites. | | | John
"Extremism in the defense of Liberty is no vice!" Senator Barry Goldwater, 1964 Make America Great Again! |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 13,202 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting Rifter: Quote: What appears on the screen, Unicus? Hmm? Are there quotes around the title or not? If there are, and you say they shouldn't be included under the "as credited" rule, then you are denying the reality of what your eyes see. That is irrational behavior. I don't give a damn whether they are there are not personally, but if the film makers put them there, it is stupendously ignorant and irrational not to include them as they appear. Nice try but if you are going to try to be insulting, at least know what you are talking about. There is no "as credited" rule for the title. There is for the overview and for cast and crew credits...both say to copy exactly...but there is no such rule for titles. Your belief that there is doesn't make it true. Quote: I get that you don't like them, and I get that others don't like them, but none of you have made a convincing argument as to why they should be left out if that is what appears on screen. It has nothing to do with what I like or don't like. It has everything to do with what the title is. They should be left out because they are not part of the title. I have given several examples where the title is repeated in the overview and set aside from the standard text by the use of italics, bold, ALL CAPS, different colors or any of several combinations. One would think that, if the quotes were part of the title, they would be included in the overview. The fact that they are not included tells me that they are not part of the title. On a more 'legal' note, every film I have ever seen has the title copyrighted. Again, if the quotes were part of the title, they would be included in the copyright statement. The fact that they are not included tells me that they are not part of the title. But hey, let's not let logic and common sense get in the way of a good insult filled tirade. Quote: You guys either follow the rules as written (as you so often scream at me) or admit that you're nothing but a bunch of hypocrites. I follow what the rules actually say, not what I want them to say. The rules say to take the title from the film's credits. You and Skip would have me believe that they say to copy everything that is in the title crawl. Sorry, but that isn't what they say and that isn't what I am going to do. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever. There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom. Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand. The Centauri learned this lesson once. We will teach it to them again. Though it take a thousand years, we will be free. - Citizen G'Kar | | | Last edited: by TheMadMartian |
| Registered: March 15, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 5,459 |
| Posted: | | | | We ignore most quotes, because the majority of the time they are only used to identify the title, not be part of the title itself. I grabbed a few titles off my shelf at random, and two that I've found are Frankenstein and Strangers on a Train - are you seriously saying we should now rename them "Frankenstein" and "Strangers on a Train"? The quote marks in these examples aren't part of the title, they're just there to tell us "this is the title", nothing more. And no one has put forward any argument that "Mister Roberts" is any different. We already ignore capitalisation and font style in titles (with a few exceptions), I don't see why we should not also ignore quotes when they're used in this way. | | | Last edited: by northbloke |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 6,635 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting Rifter: Quote:
What appears on the screen, Unicus? Hmm? Are there quotes around the title or not? If there are, and you say they shouldn't be included under the "as credited" rule, then you are denying the reality of what your eyes see. Sorry, there is no "as credited" verbiage in the Rule for titles. I just love the way you guys make this stuff up! | | | Hal |
| Registered: March 14, 2007 | Posts: 1,777 |
| Posted: | | | | So....how do we distinquish boldface if it appears on the screen? Italics? Colored fonts, perhaps? Underlining? Perhaps we should come up with an entire library of text codes to signal all this important information that appears on the screen. Wouldn't want to shortchange any users or break a rule, after all it appears on the screen. Once again slavish devotion to a poorly worded rule is used as justification for crap data. Brilliant. Makes you wonder how in the world we ever invented the wheel, as a species. |
|
|
Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
Page:
1... 3 4 5 6 7 ...17 Previous Next
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|