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    Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion Page: 1  Previous   Next
Pan & Scan vs. Open Matte
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorGSyren
Profiling since 2001
Registered: March 14, 2007
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It's my understanding that open matte presentation of widescreen films should be entered as Full Screen rather than as Pan & Scan. If that is correct , how are we to know if something is open matte?

It has been suggested to me that widescreen films that were originally no wider than 1.85:1 would normally be transfered as open matte for full screen presentation. Is that correct? If so, should we assume that full screen presentation of such movies are indeed open matte, and report them as Full Screen unless it can be determined that they actually are Pan & Scan?
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Gunnar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorNexus the Sixth
Collector since 1999
Registered: March 13, 2007
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An open matte presentation should be entered as full screen.

But not all 1.85:1 films used soft mattes. Some were hard matted to 1.85:1. And some were just butchered on home video regardless.

Thus, I wouldn't assume anything. I would go by the packaging unless your research shows you otherwise.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorLithurge
Paralysis by analysis
Registered: March 13, 2007
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P&S has a very specific meaning, that the film is zoomed into and image lost to fit the aspect ratio of the screen, regardless of the impact it has on the film.

Open matte means more of an image was captured at the time of filming than was used in the final version of the film.

Having said that a film being released at 1.85:1 when it was shot open matte is not being done to fit a screen, it's being done (in most cases) because that is the director's vision. You are not losing things that were meant to be seen.

So I don't see why you wouldn't use full frame for the scenarios you've outlined below.
IVS Registered: January 2, 2002
 Last edited: by Lithurge
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorGSyren
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Quoting Nexus the Sixth:
Quote:
I wouldn't assume anything. I would go by the packaging unless your research shows you otherwise.

The packaging hardly ever tells us how a fullscreen version was created, so that's really no help.
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Gunnar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorGSyren
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@Lithurge:
I know the difference between P&S and open matte. But when I profile a movie that was shot widescreen but was released fullscreen, I can seldom tell if it was created by P&S or open matte.

Nowadays films are rarely released in fullscreen if they were shot widescreen, but for older DVD released this is a problem. Knowing that a release is not in the original aspect ratio is important, but open matte is less serious than P&S.
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Gunnar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorT!M
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In most cases, you can really only be sure when you actually have the widescreen version available to compare it with. That, too, isn't very helpful, of course, but I'm afraid there really isn't an easy answer to this.

Personally, I tend to use "Full Frame" only for stuff that actually always was "Full Frame" in the first place, and use "Pan & Scan" for anything that was "modified to fit your screen" in any way. So although I very much understand that it isn't accurate, in my local database the term "Pan & Scan" is pretty much interpreted as "not in it's original widescreen aspect ratio". I can actually filter on that - I've just done that, and I can report that I've got exactly 51 DVD's with films that are (unfortunately) not presented in their original widescreen aspect ratio. That filter can come in handy: occassionally, I go through this list to see if any of them have gotten a widescreen release since I last checked. But if I list a number of them as "Full Frame", then that filter no longer works: the "open matte" transfers listed as "full frame" would then be lumped together which huge amounts of TV discs in the "full frame" format. So by listing some of these as "full frame", I'd actually be losing a bit of information that's valuable/useful to me.

Still, I do acknowledge that there's a difference between "Pan & Scan" and "Open Matte", but it's so hard to prove and/or document that I generally don't bother. But if someone actually bothered to compare widescreen and full frame versions with each other, and, based on that, claims it's open matte and should therefore be listed as "Full Frame", then I'd have no problem with that. So I'd generally tend to start out by assuming it's pan & scan, until someone manages to make a solid case that it isn't.

"Full Frame" is a strange term anyway. It could theoretically be argued that 1.78:1 is today's "Full Frame". I also have trouble with films in the 2.35:1 aspect ratio that are cropped to 1.78:1 for the DVD. There, too, I would like DVD Profiler to acknowledge somehow that I'm looking at a modified version of the original aspect ratio, but there's currently no real way to do that.
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