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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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Original Title field for TV series |
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| Author |
Message |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 13,201 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Addicted2DVD: Quote:
For me this one would work... but only for the original title field... not the title field. I want that title with season indicator as it is on the cover.... definitely. Shouldn't the people who sort by Original Title have the same option? To have it display the title, and season indicator, exactly as it is on the cover for the CoO? | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
|   | T!M | | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 8,667 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Quoting RHo:
Quote:
We do not have any source for an as credited season indicator for the original title at all. What shall we do about it?
That's not entirely true. We have the release, in the CoO, that we could look at. Not necessarily, no. It needn't have been released on home video in the CoO. | | | | Last edited: by T!M |
| | T!M | | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 8,667 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Quoting Addicted2DVD:
Quote:
For me this one would work... but only for the original title field... not the title field. I want that title with season indicator as it is on the cover.... definitely.
Shouldn't the people who sort by Original Title have the same option? To have it display the title, and season indicator, exactly as it is on the cover for the CoO? If that season indicator is stored in a separate field, then it's no problem to include that option. This was all taken into consideration, and guess what? That's precisely the beauty of the entire idea: if the pieces (titles, original titles, season indicators) are stored seperately, it should be easy to display them in any combination anyone might want to see. It's only now that several pieces are (wrongly) stuck together in one field that we're limited in choosing how we want it displayed. | | | | Last edited: by T!M |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 17,329 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting T!M: Quote:
Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
Quoting Addicted2DVD:
Quote:
For me this one would work... but only for the original title field... not the title field. I want that title with season indicator as it is on the cover.... definitely.
Shouldn't the people who sort by Original Title have the same option? To have it display the title, and season indicator, exactly as it is on the cover for the CoO?
If the season indicator is stored in a separate field, then it's no problem to include that option. Right if it is a free text field where it can be entered as per case and then just series title only in original title field... then have it so that when having their list it shows... Original Title Field: Season Indicator Field ... in the listing then it is no problem it will work perfectly. But when it comes to something like was mentioned earlier number checkboxes field like we have for subtitles... then I am against that. For me as long as it maintains both the title and the season/disc indicators for both the title field and original title field... whether with 1 2 or 3 fields... then I am a happy camper. | | | | Pete |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,201 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting T!M: Quote:
Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
Quoting RHo:
Quote:
We do not have any source for an as credited season indicator for the original title at all. What shall we do about it?
That's not entirely true. We have the release, in the CoO, that we could look at.
Not necessarily, no. It needn't have been released on home video in the CoO. And, in those cases, there shouldn't be a season indicator in the original title field as there was no such animal. The original title would simply be the title of the series. Quote:
If that season indicator is stored in a separate field, then it's no problem to include that option. This was all taken into consideration, and guess what? That's precisely the beauty of the entire idea: if the pieces (titles, original titles, season indicators) are stored seperately, it should be easy to display them in any combination anyone might want to see. And who, pray tell, is going to move all those season indicators to that new field? While it might be possible for Ken to move some of them, there is no way he is going to get them all moved. Seems like an awful lot of work for a band aid. Quote:
It's only now that several pieces are (wrongly) stuck together in one field that we're limited in choosing how we want it displayed. For me, the season indicator is absolutely part of the title so 'wrongly' is just a matter of opinion. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 17,329 |
| | Posted: | | | | I understand what you are saying Martian... as I agree with you that it is part of the title. I just don't mind the title being separated into 2 fields if it...
1. Serves a good purpose (making the CLT work better)
2. don't stop people from having it list correctly in the list... whether you are using the title option or the original title option. | | | | Pete |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 6,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting T!M: Quote:
Maybe we should go discussing the problem of the inability of the CLT to deal with TV credits in the "New Actor/Crew Linking System", then? 
By this twisted logic, every thread remotely related to cast and crew - including every single common name-finding thread, could be turned into the umpteenth plea for a new linking system. I'm very sorry, but I find this stance unreasonable and immature. Well, then I must be immature, since a new linking system is the only reasonable solution....not only to the issue identified in the OP, but for every Common Name thread and any number of other threads. Perhaps if we concentrated on the larger problem, namely the linking system, instead of all the little nuisance symptoms, we could convince Ken to listen to us! Or not. | | | | Hal |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 2,759 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
(...) For original title, it should match what was released in the CoO. Huh, I've never heard that. The CoO could have no release at all and therefore no season indicator. Or it could have more than one release with different season indicators. I thought that the current consensus and Gerry's clarification defines the original title's season indicator as the translation of the title's season indicator into the language of the CoO. But this as well could result in non linking original titles because different releases do use different season indicators. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 2,759 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Quoting RHo:
Quote:
We do not have any source for an as credited season indicator for the original title at all. What shall we do about it?
That's not entirely true. We have the release, in the CoO, that we could look at. Isn't that what we do with films, when the original title isn't included on the release being profiled? Or am I missing something obvious here? First, no, we may not have a release in the CoO (as a DVD season set) to get the season indicator from. Second, no, we do not take the original title from the cover of the DVD release in the CoO. We take it from the film release (theatrical, TV) in the CoO. (Actually, I would prefer to take it from the film's world premier no matter in what country that happened.) | | | | Last edited: by RHo |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,201 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting RHo: Quote:
Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
(...) For original title, it should match what was released in the CoO.
Huh, I've never heard that. The CoO could have no release at all and therefore no season indicator. Or it could have more than one release with different season indicators. As I said to T!M, if there was no release in the CoO...and I mean that to be the place where it was originally broadcast...then there wouldn't be a season indicator in the original title field. As for your second statement, I don't believe I have ever seen that. Do you have an example? Quote:
I thought that the current consensus and Gerry's clarification defines the original title's season indicator as the translation of the title's season indicator into the language of the CoO. I have no idea what the current consensus is, and that may be what Gerri's clarification indicated, but I wasn't addressing either. I was offering my opinion as to what I think it should be. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 2,759 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Shouldn't the people who sort by Original Title have the same option? To have it display the title, and season indicator, exactly as it is on the cover for the CoO? Again, the film (or TV show) in a foreign country has a direct connection to the film (TV show) in the CoO. Therefore we can use the CoO as a source for the original title of a film (TV show). On the other hand, the DVD release of a season set of a TV show in a foreign country has no direct connection to a more or less equivalent release in the CoO. The TV show may even not be released as a DVD season set in the CoO at all. We have seen this for many US TV shows in the past which have been released as season sets in Europe before they have been released as season sets in the USA. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,201 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting RHo: Quote:
Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
That's not entirely true. We have the release, in the CoO, that we could look at. Isn't that what we do with films, when the original title isn't included on the release being profiled? Or am I missing something obvious here?
First, no, we may not have a release in the CoO (as a DVD season set) to get the season indicator from.
Second, no, we do not take the original title from the cover of the DVD release in the CoO. We take it from the film release (theatrical, TV) in the CoO. (Actually, I would prefer the films world premier no matter in what country that happened.) It seems I wasn't clear enough, so I will try again. For films, we use the title as released in the CoO. For TV shows, we do the same thing. What we can't get, from the actual broadcast title, is the season indicator...mainly because there isn't one when it is broadcast. Since we can't get it from there, getting it from the equivalent release in the CoO, makes the most sense to me. In my opinion, standardizing doesn't make sense because it is made up information. Translating what is on the cover doesn't make any sense either because that may not be what it was called in the CoO. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 2,759 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Quoting T!M:
Quote:
Not necessarily, no. It needn't have been released on home video in the CoO.
And, in those cases, there shouldn't be a season indicator in the original title field as there was no such animal. The original title would simply be the title of the series. Again huh! In one case you take the original title including the season indicator for a foreign set from an "equivalent" release in the CoO and in the other case you take the title from the TV release in the CoO. Either we always take it from the TV release or never. But to be consistent with films where we take it from the theatrical release, we should take it here as well from the TV release. And because TV releases usually don't have season indicators listed, we have to take this indicator from an other source. Possible candidates are the translation of the season indicator on the cover in the language of the CoO, or the season indicator of the cover without translation, or a standardised season indicator. Or we could leave out the season indicator completely for the original titles. All those possibilities have their own drawback. But taking the season indicator from a possibly non-existent (not released) or ambiguous (more than one release) "equivalent" set from the CoO is not an option IMO. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting RHo: Quote:
Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
(...) For original title, it should match what was released in the CoO.
Huh, I've never heard that. The CoO could have no release at all and therefore no season indicator. Or it could have more than one release with different season indicators.
I thought that the current consensus and Gerry's clarification defines the original title's season indicator as the translation of the title's season indicator into the language of the CoO.
But this as well could result in non linking original titles because different releases do use different season indicators. The Martian is correct, rho. the field is called ORIGINAL Title. there is nothing that refers to whether or not a DVD has been produced in some COO, simply what the Original title IS.  | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 2,759 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
As for your second statement, I don't believe I have ever seen that. Do you have an example? You ask about two releases with different season indicators in the CoO? No, I have no example at hand. But TV seasons do get re-released with different packaging, don't they? Chances are that different cover designs feature different forms of season indicators. So, just for fun, I have looked into the online database: 011301-643131 The Adventures of Robin Hood Season 1 (actually the cover states Season One) 683904-505798 The Adventures of Robin Hood: The Complete First Season 024543-079286 Angel: Season Two on DVD 024543-233411 Angel: Season 2 024543-267287 Bones: Season One 024543-637349 Bones: The Complete First Season Just to name the first three which I have found. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 2,759 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
For films, we use the title as released in the CoO. For TV shows, we do the same thing. What we can't get, from the actual broadcast title, is the season indicator...mainly because there isn't one when it is broadcast. Since we can't get it from there, getting it from the equivalent release in the CoO, makes the most sense to me. Except that an "equivalent" may or may not exist. Or it may be ambiguous. |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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